1098 gearbox parts

Need help with your tranny? Check this forum for advice.

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Wed May 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Well out of 3 dismantled gearboxes (2 ribcase and 1 smooth) I have mixed and matched and nothing makes much difference. One thing I haven't tried is a totally new set of balls and plungers, but the plungers are not available now AFAIK.

Actually I am getting used to the smoothcase box now. Of course the car is a demon off the line with the low 1st and 2nd :) It's just the dropping off the cam before grabbing 3rd.......
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Charlie Tolman » Fri May 16, 2008 2:00 am

I have again been studying the section views in the shop manual, depicting the shifter rods, detents, balls, and springs, which comprise the transmission shifting logic.

With or without gears in the transmission case, I would be tempted to install the shift rods, etc., without the three gear selection forks, and evaluate the presence or absence of smooth "shifting" without moving the two synchro-hubs or the reverse intermediate gear. This should help to locate the problem area, if the mock shifting is unsuccessful. It is important to observe whether there are problems in selecting a gear, or problems in un-selecting a gear (stuck in gear). In this case, the gears are not really being selected, but the operation of the shift rods, etc., is being evaluated.

Without insulting your intelligence, one of the plungers is round on both ends (interlock), and three others are round on one end and flat on the other. I assume that all of these plungers have been installed correctly.

I looked through my spare parts, and I have three of the long plungers that are flat on one end, in addition to one spring. These are not for an interlock function, but are to locate the shift rods. Two of these are under the side cover, towards the front, or lower-right portion of the side opening. The third is located in the bottom of the case in the same plane as the other two. These could be mailed to you, if you want them.

Charlie Tolman
Charlie Tolman
Judson Supercharged
 
Posts: 1197
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:36 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Fri May 16, 2008 2:47 am

Thanks again Charlie. I am just off to Goodwood today so once the Healey w/e is over I'll have another go, taking your advice with the selectors. I'm pretty sure I have tried this but worth another very careful attempt. You are of course right about all the plungers and I have them in the right places (and I have spares). I have both the official workshop manual and the official parts book with exploded diagrams. Actually the manual is not very good, and contains a few errors, eg you can't knock the first motion shaft out forwards because the gear is too big. But that's another matter.
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Charlie Tolman » Fri May 16, 2008 9:34 am

Goodwood !! I have event envy.

I was fortunate, on a six-week extended business trip to Northern Ireland in 1999, to spend a few days in Stratford, traveling each of the days to Silverstone to attend the Formula-1 race.
This was the race where M. Schumacher crashed into the barrier at Stowe, on the first lap of the race.

Here in the "colonies", SCCA has just announced that the Championship Runoffs will be held at Road America in Wisconsin for three years, starting in 2009. I have raced many times at RA, and it is my favorite track, at 4.0 miles in length, three long straights, several hills, and a few challenging corners. The track is about 315 miles from my home, in the Minneapolis, Minnesota area. This announcement almost makes me want to buy another car. It has been a few years since I retired from racing. My old '63 Sprite is now being campaigned in Texas.

Charlie T.
Charlie Tolman
Judson Supercharged
 
Posts: 1197
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:36 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Sun May 18, 2008 2:07 pm

Just back from Goodwood (this is seriously off topic now but I don't think anyone else is participating!). The 15 minute track session was a stormer. I had a mark 4 Sprite in front and got past it twice. There was a race prepared mark 4 behind me at the start but I never saw it again. Most of the time I was on my own, except for the 3 Big Healeys in front which were so slow that I even grabbed 2nd at the chicane - with the smoothcase gearbox! No overtaking under braking or on corners sadly, so I just had to sit behind and blast past on the exit. The home made aeroscreen was a bit floppy and wilted under the slipstream, so that needs further thought. It was more for show than anything.

Now it's back to the garage to play with those selectors. I'll get to the bottom of it if it kills me.
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:52 pm

Update:
Yes I know this is long afterwards, but I thought you would like to know the diagnosis. I took the ribcase to Hardy Engineering (http://www.hardyengineering.co.uk/), and they found that the front bearing was wrong. Apparently the bearings for smooth and ribcase boxes are different - the latter is slightly thicker. BUT the thicker one is no longer made so the usual practice is to add a spacer. When I rebuilt the box I ordered the bearing by part number and got an early thinner one, when I should have been sent a spacer to go with it. Thus the gear cluster was sliding up and down a bit, sometimes working and sometimes not. I could not have spotted this from the official workshop manual (which doesn't mention it), the official parts book, or the Moss website which is based on the parts book anyway. So to find out all this has cost me GBP 270 for a rebuild.

The ribcase is back in the car now and working fine, which reminded me to update you guys.
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Ragnars-Frogeye » Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:53 pm

Hallo Asolepius,

your story about rebuilding a gearbox is very helpful to me. My 9CG (smooth) gearbox has a very bad laygear. I was looking for it nearly 4 years an d I got a new one near Droitwich.
My topic you can read here too. The problem I have to solve is may now be solved - getting out the spring rings form the laygear. The new laygear has no rings, but I have two old ones.The original out of my box with only half the teeth on the first gear, and one from a later box (60 Numbers) but 15 years stored in a garage with some wearing on the first gear.
At last you mentioned the wrong bearings you got, which one is different? As I bought all the bearings for the box, I don't want to get into the same trouble you did.

Thank you for your good story as I found the help there I needed. :D :D :D

Ragnar from a very cold Germany

PS: For a none native speaker: is there any difference between a cluster and a laygear or is it just another word as I think :?:
Last edited by Ragnars-Frogeye on Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Greetings from Germany

Ragnar
http://www.ragnars-frosch.de
AN5L-1443
10CG engine
9CG gearbox
User avatar
Ragnars-Frogeye
948cc
 
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 3:27 pm
Location: Wunstorf, Germany

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Tue Jan 06, 2009 4:01 am

Ragnar - you were very lucky to find an early laygear! But don't worry about the bearings, as according to Hardy Engineering the early bearing is the only one available now. Very odd - it usually works the other way around, as early parts are the first to disappear. BTW I have another 1098 gearbox in pieces if anyone is interested, but it does need a new laygear (GBP47 from Mini Spares), bearings and synchros.
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Ragnars-Frogeye » Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:18 pm

Hallo Asolepius
thanks for fast answering, tomorrow I'll try to tap the rings out and I'll report.

Regards from -8°C now
Greetings from Germany

Ragnar
http://www.ragnars-frosch.de
AN5L-1443
10CG engine
9CG gearbox
User avatar
Ragnars-Frogeye
948cc
 
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 3:27 pm
Location: Wunstorf, Germany

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:26 pm

Sorry Ragnar - I forgot to answer your question. The laygear is the one-piece item with the 4 forward gears and reverse all cast together. I call the `cluster' the assembly of the first the third motion shafts which carry all the separate gears that mesh with the laygear.
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby fastvee » Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:28 pm

Thanks everyone, this thread has been very helpful and I have made a mental note to always check the thickness of the front bearing. I will be assembling my new close ratio box soon and probably would have dealt with the same problem. I purchased the gear set from Hardy Engineering and would recommend them highly. I didn't see where your original question about differences between 1098 and 1275 boxes was answered, so I will add what little I know. There were two 1098 transmissions, and the gears in the early ones were a different pressure angle, the late 1098 box should be the same as the 1275. No worry about mismatching those gears because I believe they won't even mesh together.
John
Fogelsville, PA
67 MG Midget, Resto Project
74 MG Midget, Driver
62 A.H. Sprite, SCCA H/P
fastvee
Pit Crew
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 4:21 pm
Location: Fogelsville, PA

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Ragnars-Frogeye » Wed Jan 07, 2009 11:49 am

Hallo fastvee,

As far as I know the only way to identify your gearbox is the laygear. With the number on it you can see, which gearbox you have.
laygear 948 9C smooth box 2 A 3358 Alternatives , not available use 22A 287
22A 203 Alternatives , not available use 22A 287
22A 287
laygear 948 9CG smooth box 22A207
laygear 1098 10 CG rib case 22 G 76
1275 must be rib case 22G1100

Is there another 1098 gearbox with laygear 22G1100?

tapping the rings of my laygear must start on Thursday
Greetings from Germany

Ragnar
http://www.ragnars-frosch.de
AN5L-1443
10CG engine
9CG gearbox
User avatar
Ragnars-Frogeye
948cc
 
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 3:27 pm
Location: Wunstorf, Germany

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby fastvee » Wed Jan 07, 2009 12:12 pm

Thanks Ragnar for more useful info. I don't believe there is another 1098 gear box, just that the ribcase w/ 22G1100 laygear was used on the later 1098's. I couldn't define it better until you posted the laygear part numbers. I will try to verify that this evening.
John
Fogelsville, PA
67 MG Midget, Resto Project
74 MG Midget, Driver
62 A.H. Sprite, SCCA H/P
fastvee
Pit Crew
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 4:21 pm
Location: Fogelsville, PA

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Ragnars-Frogeye » Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:15 pm

Hallo again,
it worked :D :D :D
The rings are out of the old laygear and in the new one.
@ Asolepius thanks for the explanation of cluster :)
Now I going to work on my smooth box.
By the way, does anyone know what I have to change if I'll try to build in the rib case cluster and all into a smooth case?

Bye for now and
Greetings from Germany

Ragnar
http://www.ragnars-frosch.de
AN5L-1443
10CG engine
9CG gearbox
User avatar
Ragnars-Frogeye
948cc
 
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 3:27 pm
Location: Wunstorf, Germany

Re: 1098 gearbox parts

Postby Asolepius » Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:58 pm

Ragnar - the 1098 gears won't fit into the early box, but I understand that you can machine the box to accept them. But why would you want to do that?
Les Rose, Salisbury, UK
1959 Sprite, owned since 1978
Asolepius
1098cc
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:50 am
Location: Salisbury, UK

PreviousNext

Return to Transmission (Gearbox)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron